From: Level42-request @ worldmachine.com (Level42 Digest) Subject: Level42 Digest V97 #136 _ ____ _ ____ _ _ ___ // //__ // / //__ // /__// __// //__ //__ \\_/ //__ //__ // /__ D I G E S T Level42 Digest Volume 97 : Issue 136 504 subscribers Today's topics: Getting a life!!! Bill Miller The Digest lolita About The Digest Pat Flanagan Newbies and what-not J Shuford AYGB falls on virgin ears John Brindley Playing in E Jason Bell Are you hearing what I hear? Chuck Hat Update Winman42 Here we go again ... Vince Mora Digest content! Heh, heh... DonZipf awoken from slumber... Eric J. Hansen Average White Band & 42 J Shuford ------------------------------ Subject: Getting a life!!! From: bmiller @ abbeywood.com (Bill Miller) Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 11:53:18 +0100 (BST) Well What a load of old codswallop Thomas Richmond has written he says that he thinks the digest should be for "personal insights on lyrics, references" etc well if that's what you want why criticize the other personal views of other members. Dont be so narrow minded that we all want to talk about what you want. I too am a reasonably new member of the digest and I will say that every member that I have seen contributing to this digest seems to be far more decent than some of the other couple of digests I receive and I have taken a back seat because no doubt half of what you want to see has already been mentioned many times before. Maybe you should subscribe to the Weirdy Beardy Digest for the study of Simultaneous Equations!!!! Let people talk about their own opinions and subjects and take the digest for what it is and what these people say. The digest has a multitude of characters and personailites let them have their say. Everybody has their own opinion!!! If you don't like it, leave it. Get out a bit more, Take some drugs, have some sex with some women and get a life!!!! P.S. You DO sound like an ingrate P.P.S. Although I do have a degree and am mildly intelligent what did you mean when you said "one that can be dissertized to the extent of anality" You are a serious propellor hat. Bill Miller ------------------------------ Subject: The Digest From: lolita @ interserv.com Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 05:40:12 -0700 Hi there: I agree with your assessment about music theory and mini-disc and all that, but your best bet is to flip past these. This digest has been around for a long time (over three years), and the band is no longer recording so we sometimes hit lulls. Believe me, a lot of what you expected when you came on has been discussed ad nauseum [i.e. the virtues of The Chinese Way, Gary Husband vs. Phil Gould]. Also, a lot of seemingly off topic content interests many other digesters. For example, a significant minority of members are bassists, and there was a bass thread that lasted a few weeks earlier this year. Many folks got a lot out of it even if they weren't direct participants, including me. I have gained a lot of useful info, particularly bands I never heard of before, through this digest. I would hate to see that go, and I think a lot of others feel the same. As I said earlier, the best thing to do would probably be to hit PgDn like I do. I am not discounting your comments, but it is hard to make 500 people happy all at the same time. I think we are doing the best we can. Lolita ------------------------------ Subject: About The Digest From: Pat Flanagan Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 09:32:57 -0400 > I was under the impression that this forum would be utilized for: personal > insights on lyrics, songs, and band members, relative news, references, > gatherings, releases, *general info,* and making acquaintances other > enthusiasts. A *treff punkt* so to speak. Once contact has been made, > any correspondence, other than that especially for the masses, I feel, > should be made via e-mail, land line, cellular, post, homing pigeon, > smoke signals, or whatever. > > Out of the past 10 digests I've received I have felt that around 25% of > the content has been pertinent. Does anyone else agree with this? Or > am I out of place? Let me know what you think. No, you're exactly right. But here's some insight from someone who's been in this digest for around two years now. Every once in awhile, some of us will get on a subject (i.e., music theory) that starts as some sort of examination of something in a song, and ends up turning into long discourses. It just happens, and if it's something I'm not interested in, I scroll past it. It works itself out, and we're eventually onto other subjects. You'll find that some issues of the digest contain tons of interesting L42 facts and figures, some won't. That's just the nature of the beast. > As for the religion topic. I don't care if Level 42 are Heaven's Gate > members or Greek Orthodox ministers - I am a fan. If one is concerned > that there's hidden meaning or an agenda in a song's lyrical content > then that person should shut off their TV, radio, burn all their > books and software media and move to Antarctica, without any sort > telecommunications. I simply am not that susceptible and, or, gullible. The religion (and politics) thing pops up from time to time, and I don't think there's anyone here who's "concerned" about any hidden agendas or anything. It's just some of those "personal insights" you were looking for, that's all. Don't read too much into what people say here. A lot of times, we're taking a flyer on what might have been meant by the lyrics. > I'll bet that if you played *Staring At The Sun* to twenty different > people, you would have twenty *vastly* different interpretations. Exactly, which is why I find these discussions interesting. Sometimes, I see a new interpretation of a song that really makes a lot of sense to me, that I wouldn't have thought of without this great discussion group. Sometimes, some of the interpretations strike me as rubbish, too. But that happens. Just stick with the digest, ok? Bear with the uninteresting topics, and look for the nuggets. > My question is: could it be "our" Jakko? (They didn't print his last > name...) I believe it is. Can't be too many "Jakko"'s out there. Pat Flanagan Publishing & Design PO Box 281, Granger, IN 46530-0281 email: pfpd @ pfpd.com website: http://www.pfpd.com TOTALMEDIA PUBLISHING: Print * Disk * Interactive * CDROM * Internet ------------------------------ Subject: Newbies and what-not From: J Shuford Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 08:28:25 -0700 (PDT) Advice for the Young at Heart: Welcome to the Level 42 Digest. Here you'll find all manner of conversation about Level 42 and related topics. You'll also note that we are talking about a band that is nearly 3 years dead and hasn't had any "new" material from any of its members released with the exception of Jakko and Boon doing solo albums. With 365 days in a year and nearly 500 people subscribed, there are going to be lots of threads that perhaps a newbie isn't expecting to see. Reason? In many ways we've talked about it already. It's chronicled in the Level 42 FAQ at Synth's site or whatever. Now, in order to keep this digest vital (and it always needs some revitalization, which is why people like me keep throwing out even the most tangential threads), please offer some positive topic ideas to balance out the criticism of the old ones. We do need your voice in this forum, but we also need it to be one that contributes positively as well as being one that contributes critically. Shuf John Shuford Department of Philosophy University of Oregon Eugene, OR 97403-1295 (541) 346-1054 shuf @ darkwing.uoregon.edu ------------------------------ Subject: AYGB falls on virgin ears From: "John Brindley" Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 12:40:28 -0700 Oh Yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank you Zaphod, as well as the others involved in the Burner Project, for sending this incredible collection to me. I just heard it last night for the first time, I sat out on my girlfriend's balcony under the Memphis sky. (Groovin' hard) I have many friends from my college days that aren't subscribers to the digest that would love to own a copy of As Years Go By. Because of the recent controversy over distribution of AYGB, and since I don't want to jeopardize this incredible service, I want to ask you all how to get a copy to my very good Levelhead friends of the Mississippi Delta. Would it be cool if I gave them your address Zap and just had them mail the cheese? If any of you don't own Pat Metheny's "Still Life Talking", buy it! "In the hands of a few." J.B. ------------------------------ Subject: Playing in E From: Jason Bell Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 18:42:26 +0100 (BST) > I've been away climbing mountains for the past week and am just catching > up on my Digests (and recovering from a 40 foot fall which left me > battered). Did Mark play the open 'E' a lot because it lends itself > well as a repetitive, percussive 'filler' to fall back on as you play > other non-open notes? In which case, isn't it harder to slap in open > 'E' because you have less control over the note? 'Love Games' wouldn't really work in any other key (in bass guitar terms). I completely agree on the left hand 'filling'. Left hand damping was something i practised for years, just till it sounded right. It's easier to control the articulation of the note playing open E. If you played the same bassline in G you'd have to have your index finger on the G note and the other three finger do the damping. This doesn't leave much freedom for you left hand to grab a note here or there. In E you can play double stops (two note chords) and keep the groove going as well. If I haven't explained myself, please say so.. In fact, I've just tried it on my bass, in E then in G and G doesn't work at all. Sorry 'bout the fall. Jason Bell Email : xdr44 @ dial.pipex.com OR Jason.Bell @ PEmail.net WWW : http://dialspace.dial.pipex.com/town/estate/xdr44/ Chapman Stick Player and a Member Of The HTML Writers Guild ------------------------------ Subject: Are you hearing what I hear? From: Chuck Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 18:44:48 +0000 Hey kids, I can't believe my ears! I'm sitting at my desk during a rare office day for me (I'm usually out on the road doing the sales thing) and what do I hear faintly in the background on the Muzak system? Their version of Leaving Me Know!!! Add this one to the strange places list. Not a bad version, either. They even did the piano part at the end pretty well. So I crank up the volume on my telephone (pressing the hold button pipes the music through the speaker on the phone) and I start jamming, to strange looks from my co-workers, of course. I have heard some good renditions of other songs from artists like Spyro Gyra, Lee Ritenour, and especially Steely Dan (I've counted 29 different Dan tunes in over four years here), but never our boys. I just had to share that with all of you, since you're the only ones who might get a kick out of it. Oh, BTW, my fiance's pregnant with twins. Wedding next month. Later, Chuck ------------------------------ Subject: Hat Update From: Winman42 @ aol.com Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 16:54:47 -0400 (EDT) Hey everyone, have a great weekend. Here is the list of who has ordered a Vegas Levelfest hat, and what payments I have received so far. (as of Friday morning) I'll place the order when I get the rest of the payments, so push your local mailman!! Winston ANGEL ROGERO 2 BILL MILLER 2 PAID BILL WILSON 2 PAID BRUCE CONRAD 1 PAID CARL MUELLER 1 DAN JAMES 1 DON ZIPF 1 PAID EMIKATIE 1 JAY TRACY 2 PAID JEFF GROUS 1 JENNIFER REDDIN 1 JERRY REHN 2 KARA T. 1 KRISTEN LAGE 1 PAID LOLITA JACKSON 1 LYLE BOSLEY 2 MARK TWEEDALE 1 MATT RICE 2 MIKE KENNEALLY 1 MICHAEL VON KROSIGK 1 PAID MYSTERIO 71 1 RANDALL COLLINS 2 ROB KADEL 1 ROYAL MOORE 1 STACEY NOLTIN 1 PAID TAMPACHUCK 1 WINSTON 2 TOTAL 35 ------------------------------ Subject: Here we go again ... From: "Vince Mora" Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 14:58:57 -0600 (MDT) Thomas Richmond writes: > May I Have Your Attention Please: > > Listen, I am a new subscriber and I guess I was expecting something > different. Ok, then hang on right there. Read what you just wrote: "I am a new subscriber". By typing this you seem to imply you are aware that you have recently dropped into a group that has been doing what they're doing for a long time. > If the need is great enough, you can e-mail each other on the topic. > Everyone's e-mail address is provided within message content. > > Second: If the subject pertains to a private venture or a simple thanks > is order, send a personal e-mail to the appropriate party. In a nutshell, Thomas: you cannot presume to dictate rules and behaviors to hundreds of people. There is no "ten commandments" of mailing list conduct -- each list has its own vibe and rules. The vibe around here was established a long time ago, and is dictated by the members of the list as a collective -- making this place in some ways more of a virtual community. These things are not planned -- it just falls into place naturally. Get a bunch of personalities who share an interest, lock them in a room for 12 hours, and see what happens. Same thing. > This is mainly direct at *Gert Emmens* "dirk.vael" topics are related to and, hell!, I don't know what *TBWYA* is let alone > *a.d.s.c.* *To Be With You Again* maybe? (That wasn't much bandwidth > was it?) One shouldn't have to guess. This is normally what FAQ's are for, to explain to newbies what various slang and acronyms and whatnot mean. These arise out of frequent talk on a specific issue, and it's commonplace to abbreviate words and expressions to more quickly communicate (IMHO - in my humble opinion, FWIW - for what it's worth, etc). Again, this is a phenomenon of Net culture that has been around for decades. > I was under the impression that this forum would be utilized for: personal > insights on lyrics, songs, and band members, relative news, references, > gatherings, releases, *general info,* and making acquaintances other > enthusiasts. It is. It's also invariably a social environment as well. These things happen; deal with it. If it bugs you so much, unsubscribe. No one is forcing you to stay on here. By the same token, however, you cannot just drop in and demand that everyone change the way they interact. It is pretentious and naive, not to mention insulting to the members. > PS - Soapbox mode still on. Not good. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Vince Mora www.swcp.com/synth/ L42 Home Page synth @ swcp.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- "Bother," said Pooh, as Piglet tried to cast fireball. ------------------------------ Subject: Digest content! Heh, heh... From: DonZipf @ aol.com Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 01:51:38 -0400 (EDT) Last time, Thomas wrote.... > I was under the impression that this forum would be utilized for: personal > insights on lyrics, songs, and band members, relative news, references, > gatherings, releases, *general info,* and making acquaintances other > enthusiasts. A *treff punkt* so to speak. Once contact has been made, > any correspondence, other than that especially for the masses, I feel, > should be made via e-mail, land line, cellular, post, homing pigeon, > smoke signals, or whatever. You said 'High Priority,' Thomas, so here's my take: It is my perception that some subscribers only graze the Level 42 Digest, some probably let them pile up in their mailboxes eventually throwing them ten-at-a-time to the recycle bin, while some look forward to their Digests as others look forward to their morning papers. It becomes a staple, a part of everyday - and it is a living, breathing thing. It's not extemporaneous, like chat, but rather it is scripted...like a play, a microcosm populated with colorful characters (with colorful names, like Winston, Zaphod, Zak, Lolita). It has a history, myths and legends, tales of the early days. It produces a tangible product which enhances our lives (AYGB, etc.). It lives and breathes because the characters, we the contributors, write our own parts. We enter and exit at will.... ENTER, STAGE LEFT Thomas, young reactionary. He brings an important message for the villagers, interrupting their idol-worship. Bravo, Thomas! You have unwittingly joined in the very behavior which you criticize, and eloquently so. I raise my glass to you, sir. I think the Digest is the better for such occasional flourishes of color. If folks didn't share their pissing contests, their trivial drivel, their questionable musical tastes (BTW, the girls were particularly sassy on Regis & Kathie Lee today), then the Digest would be short, dry, & dull. If, as you suggest, people of common interest simply make contact on the Digest and then disappear behind the doors of private e-mail, then the rest of us would not be exposed to wonderful new things. I just bought two Jamiroquai CD's because I was able to eavesdrop on an ongoing dialog by other members and learn about these delightful artists. You would have that conversation stricken from the record? It had nothing to do with Level 42, after all. And didn't someone just comment that ours was the most intelligent and humorous of all the digests? Nay, say I. Let it be what it will. (Did like your ideas about homing pigeons and smoke signals, though!) Nigel wrote.... > In which case, isn't it harder to slap in open 'E' because you have less > control over the note? No, that would seem to be a forgone conclusion, but you see, the whole trick to the Mark King slap technique is in that left hand, the fret hand, NOT in the thumb. That open 'E' isn't so open under the strict, disciplined control of that left hand...slapping, choking, muting, bending, and...oh yeah...occasionly actually just fretting a note or two. The thumb distracts most viewers, but any student of The Master will tell you, the fret hand is the business end, so all four strings are under tight control at all times. In effect, it's as if there are no open (unmuted) strings when he plays. Watch the live vids. So, anyone wanna talk about cigars? Don Z. ------------------------------ Subject: awoken from slumber... From: "Eric J. Hansen" Organization: Worldmachine Technologies Corporation Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 02:22:28 -0400 (EDT) Hardly! Sorry if I seem to have been "out of sight" with the Level 42 Digest... rest assured, I read every digest and dilligently follow threads, reformatting text, answering personal emails, etc. So, with the "new" thread brought up by Thomas Richmond, I felt compelled to whip up something profound and try to put a universally friendly spin on things... however, after seeing the comments made above, I don't really think I need to do too much. BUT, lest I slumber further... After nearly four years (come August) of Level 42 Digest, we've certainly grown to be a "mature" mailing list -- we've got stability and a strong sense of community. One may notice upon arrival here that there's alot of talk about non-Level 42 stuff. After a while, though, I think people come to understand that there are actually many other common interests among our subscribers, and that this just happens to be a fine place to talk about them. This is the main difference between Level 42 Digest and other, more restricted-topic formums... Sure, we all like (or worship, as the case may be) Level 42, but the subscribers here have, over the past few years, molded the list into what it is today. Within the minimal-but-necessary guidelines that I've established (new subscribers receive them in the "welcome" message, and they are on the Digest's homepage), this is an open forum by virtue of those who continue to read and contribute to it. Eric Manager, Level 42 Digest -- Eric J. Hansen Worldmachine Technologies Corporation http://www.worldmachine.com tel: 617.492.1929, fax: 617.492.1953 ------------------------------ Subject: Average White Band & 42 From: J Shuford Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 02:43:07 -0700 (PDT) Does anybody out there know much about the Average White Band? Any fans? Recommendations for a good place to start with their music. I was listening to some 70's compilation CDs tonight, and I came upon the song Pick up the Pieces. I didn't know who had done it until now, and now I understood the "similar artist" link CDNow gives to AWB and L42, although they seem more in the mode of Spyro Gyra than early L42. Shuf John Shuford Department of Philosophy University of Oregon Eugene, OR 97403-1295 (541) 346-1054 shuf @ darkwing.uoregon.edu