From: Level42-request @ worldmachine.com (Level42 Digest) Subject: Level42 Digest V96 #178 _ ____ _ ____ _ _ ___ // //__ // / //__ // /__// __// //__ //__ \\_/ //__ //__ // /__ D I G E S T Level42 Digest Volume 96 : Issue 178 361 subscribers Today's topics: No Live CD - Alembic Basses Steen, Rob Hot Water, Mark's vocals, lyrics & playing Mark Nigel Collier Small World WINSTON WALKER Re: Level42 Digest V96 #177 Frans Lundquist Big megapost with flames Pat Flanagan Re: funky vs. pop NPercival Re: Mark being angry NPercival Scrambled Ramble TTrudell Re: Pilgrimage II Mr Fish Quick Thanks & Request Gary Francis Thanks for the lyrics! Mike Dutra ------------------------------ Subject: No Live CD - Alembic Basses From: "Steen, Rob" Date: Tue, 25 Jun 96 12:10:12 gmt Hi gang, Well, the Live at Wembley CD may be available in America but it hasn't hit Ireland yet and believe me I've been looking. Well I might be in London soon so I'll look there. Takeo, you asked about Alembic Series I's or II's with Coco-Bola wood. I have a friend buying a new one, hence the trip to London, actually he's buying an Essence (the second cheapest Alembic) and upgrading it to Series II quality, i.e. seven piece neck, five piece body, Series II electronics and pickups, standard point body and neck, etc. Basically we went over my Series II and picked out everything, doing it this way was a lot cheaper, however Alembic have changed their prices since and they were quite surprised by this approach and may have removed this little loophole. He's getting Coca-Bola wood on the front and back of the body and headstock - it's not a cheap wood but it is BEAUTIFUL. You can e-mail Mica Wickersham at Alembic at mica @ bass.com, but be prepared for a wait they don't respond quickly and they are very busy, but they are very friendly. If you or anyone wants more info let me know. By the way, Mica was saying that Mark showed her how to play Lessons in Love on the bass, wouldn't it be something just to sit down and talk bass with him for a while? Have fun, Rob Steen. ------------------------------ Subject: Hot Water, Mark's vocals, lyrics & playing Mark From: Nigel.Collier @ ncl.ac.uk (Nigel Collier) Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 12:53:01 +0100 *Hot Water >Hot Water is possibly my favorite Level 42 song of all time. And it's a >great vehicle - I've seen lots of bands cover it (bands that mostly were more >"funky" than L42 in the conventional sense) I'd love to hear HW covered - it was the track They opened with when I saw Them at Leeds. Not wanting to perpetuate another old chestnut like Chinese Way, but I love HW and have you heard Stevie Wonder's 'Black Man'? - the bassline is very similar to Hot Water - and they don't come much funkier than Steveland. I rest my case. *Mark's vocals >lines of "I don't want to got to war---said I need to love someone" he never >says "before the Atom bomb" anymore. Most of the time he just throws in an >agressive-type "huh!" I often wish that Mark had been more willing to 'let himself go' a bit with his vocals. I think he has a real talent for more creative singing which we don't often get to hear as I think he's a bit confined by the music at times. I can't help feeling that, given a bit more freedom (like during a concert when the adrenaline's pumping) Mark could have developed a very unique jazz vocals style, he scats brilliantly (White Funky) and I can imagine 'scatting' being quite hard to do well. Mark's definitely more than just a 'convenience' singer but I suppose a more unconventional vocal style (Morrissey or Tom Waits for example) may sometimes be less widely accepted and appreciated - a kind of voice you either love or hate - comments? * lyrics "And the techno wins the crown" - I've always thought it was, "And it's echoing somehow". *playing Mark The search for Mark's part is over!! There can only be ONE actor who could have played Mark in a Level 42 movie and that had to be Nikolaus Gunthar Nakazynski (a.k.a the late, great Klaus Kinski) "I've got friends all over the world...none in this country but all over the world" - Tony Hancock, The Radio Ham http://www.ncl.ac.uk/~nnac/ ------------------------------ Subject: Small World From: WINMAN @ gnn.com (WINSTON WALKER) Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 12:37:33 Thanks for the verification of Ian Buck's credit on the new live album. I do however, have a small problem with your response. I find it VERY uncool to make disparaging remarks about Mike Payne, or anyone else for that matter, when the individual in unable to defend himself. Earlier in the week you sent the same message, privately, to me, and you asked that i NOT repeat your "Paul Crockford" comment to Mike. Then you post the same message to the digest for everyone's perusal. Mike visited with me in New York for a weekend for the LevelFest and stayed at my apartment. All present were amazed at his generosity with his information and Level 42 collection. Obviosuly I haven't known Mike as long as Ian Buck, but this doesn't seem like something he would do. My problem is not with the validity of your statement, but with the method you used to post it. Perhaps their is a history between you and Mike that the rest of the digest is unaware of. (myself included) I just hope that in the future you think a bit before making these comments to the digest, and not to the individual you are talking about. I'm not trying to rake you over the coals, or be a jerk about the situation. It's just that the message left a bad taste in my mouth, and I thought it appropriate to respond. Can't we all just get along? :-) Now, back to the music!! Winston ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Level42 Digest V96 #177 From: frans @ lls.se (Frans Lundquist) Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 22:10:46 +0100 >Subject: Children Say >From: lolita @ interserv.com >Date: Mon, 24 Jun 1996 06:43:43 -0700 > >I haven't posted in a bit, but I have to speak up. Someone posted yesterday >that Children Say is crap. I strongly disagree!! Even though it is a more >pop-like song than Sandstorm or 88 (which are two of my favorites) it still >incorporates the Level flava. Part of the beauty of being a Level 42 fan is >appreciating why others like different eras of the band. I am on record as >despising The Chinese Way, as well as most of the Guaranteed release, and I am > >mostly a fan of their jazz-funk early period, but I can see why others would >differ on what they like. The one thing I love about this list is that we are >so diverse in our musical tastes, and we are from all over the world. I will >agree that their funk and jazz-funk periods were better, though. What do you >all think? > >Lolita You are right on the spot, Lolita! I definitely agree with you on the jazzier style of Level 42 to be the best. But, when I first found out about this list, I went trough old piles of CDs to find Forever Now, which I now, some years after I bought it was quite OK. I think that Level 42 spans over a vast area of music, and that there is a song for my every mood. If you don't like the sound of the music, the style or whatever, you can always get into the lyrics, and the other way around. WorldMachine is still their best album, but Hot Water is just great when you need an extra kick of adrenalin, all the ballads come to me a few times a year, they have their place as well! /Farbror Frans - frans @ lls.se ------------------------------ Subject: Big megapost with flames From: pfpd @ pobox.com (Pat Flanagan) Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 16:20:22 -0400 (EDT) *** WARNING! FLAME ALERT! *** *** WARNING! FLAME ALERT! *** >As for the news about Mark all of a sudden finding his new material to be >"too angry", well, that has to be the most absurd thing I've heard in some >time. He goes through all the work, even starts shopping it around, now all of >a sudden it's not right. I don't buy this. Kind of like that silly story of >Prince's Black Album, he was spouting some crap that his evil side wrote those >tunes so that he wasn't going to release it. Rubbish ! You know, Jay, the first time I read this, it didn't really sink in, but now that I've reread it a few times, I have to say... if the "material is too angry" story is true, who are you to say it's a BS story? Being a "content producer" myself (though it's not music, it's websites and interactive multimedia), I know the feeling of completing a project, letting it settle, then looking back at it and feeling like it's a piece of crap. I don't think it's too far off belief. (Of course, I'd still like to hear it...) >If you're curious about playing/learning an >instrument, start looking in pawn shops, the classified ads, etc. If you >start out at the top, buying the newest equipment, and things don't work >out, that's a long fall. If, however, you are able to make a minimal >investment, then you can get your feet wet w/o drowning. Other side of the coin: if you buy decent equipment, you can easily resell it and make most of your investment back. There is ALWAYS a market for great condition used musical instruments -- buy a good setup and KEEP IT IN GOOD SHAPE -- it will last longer if you keep it, and it will retain more of its resale value if you decide to dump it. Personally, I'd advise figuring on $300 to $400 for a bass that isn't top of the line, but will still give good performance. As for bass cabinets, I've been out of it too long to give you a good price range. > like speckled dots on a rotating ball of molten rock with a hard crusty >surface, we are the last of a die-ing breed of Level 42 fans. United by a >common >bond we will strive to achieve our ultimate goals... etc. etc. Uh oh, Mr. Green has been imbibing. >I haven't posted in a bit, but I have to speak up. Someone posted yesterday >that Children Say is crap. I strongly disagree!! Even though it is a more >pop-like song than Sandstorm or 88 (which are two of my favorites) it still >incorporates the Level flava. Here here! Children Say is an EXCELLENT pop song from Level 42 or any group. Here's why: thoughtful lyrics (reread them and THINK if you disagree), inventive bassline (tell me another non-Level 42 pop song that has counterpoint basslines like this... there aren't many), intricate layering of the instruments, and (whoo, get this) somewhat universal appeal (except for the person who didn't like it). I've only met one person, my wife, but she likes Bryan Adams and that awful Tracy Chapman "Give Me One Reason" song (somebody give her one reason to write a decent song, ok?), who doesn't like Children Say. Even two of my metalhead friends like it ("hey, that's mellow, man"). Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT saying you're wrong when you say Children Say is crap, we all have our likes or dislikes. But it will ALWAYS be a favorite of most Levelheads. >I am on record as despising The Chinese Way Lolita rules. >HEY! I *like* Hot Water! You keep that up and we're going to send you out >to live with Jules. 8) The Chant, however... I never understood people's >attraction to this one, but to each their own, right? You know, I never really clicked with The Chant, until I heard the extended remix. >My understanding was that he (Allan Holdsworth) actually only played on the track "If You Were >Mine" -- at least that's the only track on the album that has that >distinctive Allan Holdsworth sound (like it or not). We went around about this awhile back. I do remember hearing that AH played on, like, four songs, and, without knowing definitely, I say they're "Seven Years", "A Kinder Eye", "She Can't Help Herself", and "If You Were Mine". They all have that grating, spine-rattling, whiny, "see, I can make my guitar sound like a saxaphone" sound. (Guess you can figure my take on AH.) >p.p.s. Pat, did you get your tape yet?? Yep, just got it yesterday. Thank you. Zak said... >I'm moving to California now Ok, get this... Zak's gonna (ready?) Go West. HAWHAWHAW!!! Ok, I'm done. {Cool Song Lyric of the Day: "Then I thought I would come back as a spider because she hates them so much. They get sprayed down the bathroom plug hole." from "Wicked And Cruel" by Squeeze} Pat Flanagan Publishing & Design PO Box 281, Granger, IN 46530-0281 email: pfpd @ pobox.com website: http://www.pobox.com/~pfpd TOTALMEDIA PUBLISHING: Print * Disk * Interactive * CDROM * Internet ------------------------------ Subject: Re: funky vs. pop From: NPercival @ aol.com Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 16:41:25 -0400 In a message dated 22/6/96 10:05:38, you write: >I wonder if anyone agrees with me in that L42's best songs tend to be >its most commercial. IMHO, they are better off focusing on their >"pop" side than on "funk." When they attempt to get funky, the results >are often embarrassing. "The Chant Has Begun" and (even worse) "Hot >Water" are almost unbearable. On the other hand, "Micro Kid" could be >the best pop song of the 80's. > > Can't agree... because these are no way their 'funky' songs! Both the ones you mention have quite an aggressive edge to them. If you want funky, I'd pick out 'The Sun Goes Down', most of 'World Machine', most of 'Level 42', or even (my favourite chestnut) 'The Sunbed Song'. But having said that, this debate will rage forever, because I'd love to hear a definition of what is or is not 'funky' - it means different things to different people. Can anyone offer a dictionary definition? Has the word ever actually been defined? Neil Percival ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Mark being angry From: NPercival @ aol.com Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 16:41:28 -0400 In a message dated 24/6/96 10:07:06, you write: > As for the news about Mark all of a sudden finding his new material to >be >"too angry", well, that has to be the most absurd thing I've heard in some >time. He goes through all the work, even starts shopping it around, now all >of >a sudden it's not right. I don't buy this. Kind of like that silly story of >Prince's Black Album, he was spouting some crap that his evil side wrote >those >tunes so that he wasn't going to release it. Rubbish ! Hmmm. I hate to suggest this, but I would imagine that it's pretty crucial Mark gets it right with this one. If he doesn't, he makes no progress away from Level 42, no new fans, no new friends, no kudos, and no follow-up. Perhaps, friends, the material is just not up to scratch and he wants it to be 100 per cent. Maybe he's getting paranoid and thinks it's crap even if it isn't. Of course most of us on the list will be agog to hear whatever it is, but he's got a wider audience to think of, and he can't afford to release anything less than excellence at this stage in his career! Neil Percival ------------------------------ Subject: Scrambled Ramble From: TTrudell @ aol.com Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 16:43:04 -0400 LOZ, If I have to chant "Chinese Way" to save the L42 superfan world, I wouldn't do it. Sorry. I appreciated the rest of your ramble. Good luck on your job interview - try not to let on that you're crazy. I'd be interested in hearing opinions on the Remixes 2 - how is it different than Remixes 1? Also, anybody with Mark's Ear should tell his bassliness to mail copies of his angry songs to John Venzon, who can burn non-profit discs for us all. Problem Solved. And if the digest really is becoming a forum for intelligent music discussion, let me put on a smoking jacket and my eyeglasses and assume a dignified countenance as I simply say: GO WEST sucks. Again, where do I get a job where I can say that what I've been doing sucks and I'm going to take time off and start over? -TT ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Pilgrimage II From: Mr Fish Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 07:04:03 -0400 On Mon, 24 Jun 1996, Bassette wrote: > > Hi on the best Level > > du to the cancellation of some people for the pilgrimage II > what do you think of a report for another date at the end of July > or start of of August ... > > Let me know quickly ... Actually that sounds good to me as I may need that weekend (July 6th & 7th) to sort my life out a bit as I start my new job on Monday 8th. Making it a bit later, say the end of July / start of August should be fine by me. Also, as a favour to me (as I will be loosing my email account soon) could the person who's maintaing the Pilgramage II list call me or write to me to fill me in on dates and such..?? I would be really gratefull as I don't think I'll be able to stay in contact after this week. Anyway, here goes: David Goodall 9 St Andrews Road Lower Bemerton Salisbury Wiltshire England (01722) 324 461, or (01705) 831 737 (Portsmouth) If I get an email account at work I'll re-subscribe to the digest of course!! Sorry to make a fuss about this, it's just I don't want to miss out on the IOW trip!! Regards to you all... David ------------------------------ Subject: Quick Thanks & Request From: Gary Francis Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 12:46:51 -0400 Hi All, I'll like to give a big THANKS to Zak and Nigel for the effort they put into producing and shipping the L42 T-Shirts -- GREAT JOB!! I've been swamped for the last couple of months and missed the info on how to sign up for the B-sides CD. If anyone has any info on this, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks, Gary gfrancis @ hpdmd48.boi.hp.com ------------------------------ Subject: Thanks for the lyrics! From: gromit @ aimnet.com (Mike Dutra) Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 16:50:24 -0700 (PDT) Just a quick thanks for the response to the lyrics to 'Micro Kid'. Appreciate the help...Now no more 'what did he sing?' for me! Thanks! Mike ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++ The only things limitless are the Universe and human stupidity...and I'm not completely certain about the former... Albert Einstein ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++